Wow, what a great finale to cap off a great season! I have to admit, it's daunting trying to organize my thoughts into something coherent, so I'm just going to start the discussion, and see where it leads us.
We got so much in the last three hours of the season: a transfer of power, from Ben to Locke; apparitions galore, especially Christian; Sun buying out Paik Industries and confronting Widmore (the latter also confirming a long suspected Paik/Widmore connection); Charlotte born on the island?; Ben banished; Locke dead!
I think I'm going to start with the apparitions and whispers, and try to hash out their motives, who they represent, etc.
As readers of this blog know, I have never subscribed to the idea that the whispers were directly connected to the Others. This idea was first put forth by Danielle in Season 1, and Lost fans have held to it ever since.
It made sense at first, when we thought the Others were mysterious and magic. Now that we've become more intimately acquainted with them, it doesn't seem like they do a bunch of backward whispering themselves.
Also, the frequent indications that the voices include those of dead people, and not limited to the Others, has further led me to believe they are separate. I imagined them in the service of the island, like the Smoke Monster.
But of course, that group includes Jacob, and the Others clearly are in the service of Jacob. And the Others have displayed uncanny knowledge and skills in tracking and fighting. So what if they are aided by the whispers?
The scene with Keamy's team being taken out by the Others so clearly tied in the whispers with what was happening, that it became impossible for me not to see a connection. Then I thought of the whispers preceding Harper's appearance in the jungle in "The Other Woman".
Initially, I took that to mean she was an apparition. I figured this explained the somewhat unlikely locating of Juliet.
But Damon and Carlton have said she was really Harper. So maybe the whispers helped her find Juliet? And maybe the whispers helped the Others keep the advantage over Keamy's men?
The most recent transcriptions at Lostpedia are in fact from "The Other Woman", and while vague (as usual), they would seem to support this idea. Check them out here.
But the whispers also accompanied apparitions, namely Christian, when he came to the freighter to "release" Michael, and in Kate's dream, on the phone, before discovering Claire in Aaron's room.
Christian is worth a post in and of himself, so let's stick for now with apparitions who have appeared off island. Up until now, it had seemed like the goal was getting the O6 back to the island. But Kate's vision/dream was a departure, and a contradiction.
For the first time, we have an apparition (Claire) explicitly telling someone (Kate) not to go back, or actually, not to take Aaron back. Why?
In "Cabin Fever", Christian tells Locke that Aaron is where he needs to be (with Kate, ready to be rescued?), and "Claire" seems to be OK with that. Does this mean Aaron needed to be rescued? Then why does Ben want them all to go back? How many factions are there?
Also, on the phone call that woke Kate up before she encountered Claire said that she needed to go back, before it was too late. Listen to unscrambled versions here.
What's up with a dream/vision arguing both sides? Are they supposed to go back or aren't they? Who wants what outcome? Is Claire dead? Will my head explode? It makes me really wonder what Christian would have told Jack if they hadn't been interrupted in "Something Nice Back Home".
Which is another good point. Jack has apparently been listening to "Jeremy Bentham", and now Ben again. Did Christian (or the island) never make another attempt to communicate with Jack? Why is he flying so blind?
OK, that should kick this puppy off. I expect to really hash this out over the next few weeks, but I can't make it work without help, so let's get busy!
8 comments:
I don't know where to even begin! One thing I can say, the more that I think that Claire might be dead, the more I think back to what the psychich told her to get her on the plane: There is a couple in Los Angeles that can raise Aaron. Might he have been referring to Jack and Kate?
Locke: The Dalai Lama thing that Richard pulled on child Locke makes me think that perhaps he is supposed to become Jacob. But then I think no way, because we have to assume Ben has seen what Jacob looks like. So he would know if Locke was him. So then I wonder, is someone else going to become Jacob? Like Aaron? Nah, I don't think so. I'm going back to what I originally thought about Jacob, that he's been around a long time, either as part of the Black Rock crew, or perhaps part of the ancient civilization (which I also believe could be actually a future civilization). Why? The four toed statue. It clicked for me one day a few weeks back when I heard someone say that scientists believe that humans will evolve to only have four toes. I immediately thought of LOST and the statue.
I definitely believe the whispers to be dead people, and I believe them linked to Jacob and The Others. There must be a reason that The Others returned to wearing their shredded pauper-style clothing. As if when they wear normal, modern clothes, THAT is actually the costume. I mean, I think there are two kinds of Others. One is the kind like Richard, whose origins are quite unknown, and could be mysterious and date back a long way, again, from either The Black Rock or even earlier. The other kind is Ben and Tom, people who joined up more recently. People who Jacob and/or the Island summoned in some way.
Why does Claire not want Aaron to return to the Island? Will it be unsafe? Will he have some destiny she doesn't want for him? It's clear that the O6 was never suppposed to leave, and have to go back. But why? What is the purpose? Why does Ben believe that the Islanders are in danger and that killing Widmore's cartel will help? Is Widmore close to finding the island again in 2007? Will it be too late if they don't go back in time to stop him from doing something wrong?
I have a feeling that when Jack and Kate get back to the Island, they will find that Juliet and James are an item. How will that one play out?
Guess what? I'm actually caught up! I watched the finale! Of course, I'm still just as confused as always. Why are they calling Locke Jeremy Benthem? And Don, are you talking about Sawyer and Juliet??? Yuck-o. I don't want Juliet with either Jack or Sawyer! No way! Only Kate! :)
Wow Anna, I'm impressed. By all means, keep checking back, cause we're gonna hash it all out.
People are referring to Locke as Jeremy Bentham because apparently that's what he was calling himself. We don't know exactly why, but we can assume he didn't want undesirables to be aware of his actions off-island.
Jeremy Bentham is another LOST use of a historical name: the real JB was an English philosopher, just like... John Locke. He is regarded as the founder of Utilitarianism. You can read more about him here if you want.
Jack and Kate the Aaron raising couple? Could be. I'm still inclined to think the psychic made that up to get her on the plane, knowing it would crash on the island. But I don't know.
It did occur to me that Claire might not have been speaking on behalf of any faction, but rather knows the plan is to bring the O6 back, and as a mother (not a force of the island) doesn't want Aaron to go back. Again, I just don't know.
It did seem more like Locke was replacing Ben, not Jacob, although I have long wondered about a "Once and Future Jacob", so to speak. I might be more inclined to think that Aaron has something to do with that than Locke.
The evolution of humans to four-toed creatures is interesting. The statue does pretty much necessitate a civilation pre-dating the Black Rock. Time and time-loops are obviously important; maybe they are from the future. Maybe that's why Smokey seems technological on some levels.
Do you think Richard, once Ben was gone, told people to put back on their old clothes? Or is this just part of going to the Temple? I definitely agree that Richard is different from Ben and Tom, but who else is like him?
I agree they planted the Juliet/James seed at the end. Who else is left on the island alive? Not counting (maybe) Jin.
SO much to discuss. First off, Anna, I suppose you want them to have a threesome? Otherwise how can Kate fulfill your desire to be with both Jack AND James(Sawyer)? Sheesh.
Locke had to take an alias when coming back to the States, because like Michael, no one can know he is actually someone who was on Oceanic 815, he is supposed to be dead. Even Ben is supposed to be dead, not to mention he doesn't want Widmore to find him, hence all his aliases as well. (It's funny that he calls himself "Dean Moriarty" whenever he is "On The Road.") And btw, I think the most significant thing about the Jeremy Bentham reference is the fact that he invented the panopticon - a prison in which the inmates can be observed without them knowing that they are being observed. I think this very much relates to the Island. The whisperers are the invisible observers. And many Island inhabitants are criminals in some way. And there is a security system (Smokey, of course) which kills you if you don't redeem yourself, more or less. These are vague ideas, but I definitely think they relate to what's going on. Mull it over.
Well, yes, I was always inclined to think Mr. Psychic had made up the L.A. couple as well. But as I think about Jack and Kate raising Aaron in LA after he expressly said only Claire should raise Aaron, I see another dimension to it is possible, namely, that he knew all of it would happen. So why did he freak out at the first reading? Did he see her death, or did he see the Island? Or both?
Assuming the "dream" Kate had was actually a vision, then I am inclined to agree with you about the reason for Claire's insistence in not having Aaron go back to the island.
Yeah, I didn't mean Locke would replace Jacob, I meant he IS him, and in the future would travel to the past and become the leader of Th Others, or the Grand Poobah Spirit of the Island, or whatever. But I really don't see that being the case, even though it is still a possibility. Locke's spirit could end up becoming one with the island upon the arrival of his body there, and I do believe the spirits are not beholden to linear time. So there wouldn't even be time traveling, per se. But there is the issue of Ben having seen Jacob's face, one would assume he had, anyway. But I am not pursuing this as a possible theory. I think Aaron will be very important, but I don't see him becoming Jacob either.
Well, see, that's exactly what I mean. Smokey is high technology, not ancient, therefore the idea of an ancient island civilization only makes sense if said civilization traveled back in time and roosted there in the Lemurian age. And I mean hell, the frozen donkey wheel machinery is pretty high tech as well. This is advanced stuff. And clearly, they had the capability of time travel!
Hm, who else is like Richard? Well, probably no one we've met, but some of those Others must be. I wonder about Ethan. The clothing thing vexes me. The original motive for wearing it seemed to be to trick the Losties, for whatever reason. I mean, why else the fake beards? Stage makeup? But there is no obvious reason for them to be wearing it anymore. Who would they be trying to trick? Seems more likely that that is their preferred garb. And the fact that they don't seem to wear shoes is another thing. As if they are in communion with the Island. Like Native Americans, kennit? (Heh, I mean, "ya know?" Just a little reference for ya. I'm in the middle of book 4.) I think that The Others started as refugees from the Black Rock crash, and discovered some things themselves once they ended up there. Hell, I'd love a spin-off series that starts with THAT particular crash! How bitchin' would THAT be?
Anyway, I don't see the clothing as a temple-only thing, as they have been dressed like that often, all over the island. Maybe the "newbie" Others use the clothing at certain times, but aren't inclined to it?
Who IS still on the island? Jin, who I assume is still alive, but heck, his future role could be that of ghost as well; Locke; Charlotte and Daniel, and Miles; Juliette and James; Rose and Bernard; The Others, of course; hm, is that it? We have to assume that between the New Otherton assault and the freighter explosion, all the background Losties bought it, redshirt-style. I can't think of anyone else.
Yer slackin, bro
ketchup!
Anyhoo, I have this theory. Get ready!! The obit said Jeremy Bentham had a teenage son. Helen must have been pregnant!!! He lost use of his legs in 2000, she dumped him before that, we don't know how long prior though do we? Hm, this would place birth of a kid (if Locke actually has one) at approx. 1994. I would say that probably couldn't be Helen, too early. "Cabin Fever" skipped a big chunk of Locke's life, jumping from teenager to post-8-story-fall. And what's the earliest flashback we've seen of him otherwise? When he was working at the toy store and first met his mother, right? We would have to place that flashback at just a few years prior to the fall. So what's the verdict? Do we think Locke has a son with a previous wife/lover, or is the info in the obit faked? But two questions remain. 1. Why fake the existence of a son in the falsification of Jeremy Bentham? 2. If he DOES have a son, how is the son caught up in the Bentham ruse? He wouldn't be named that or need to have anything to do with it. And Locke would have only been off-island a short time, anyway, right? I mean, I would assume he spent the time in between January 2005 and whenever in 2007 mostly on the island. Of course he might be leaving and coming back like Ben was doing for awhile.
Oh it's all so confusing. Why this teenage son nonsense? I thought perhaps he adopted Walt but of course Walt seems to still be off island in 2007. I'm going to watch this whole season again soon.
I wonder if it's not as simple as that the "teenage son" wasn't meant to be canon. Even though the "J...ntham" did turn up, maybe the rest isn't meant to be official.
I know the rule of thumb is, "if it happens onscreen, it's canon," but there was the case of Juliet's sister's medical charts. Close examination revealed some discrepancies, but consensus was that it was a production error. The point is, just because they know we examine this show with a fine tooth comb, doesn't mean everything, especially when it's small, blurry, and otherwise not meant to be seen, is meant to be taken as gospel.
That being said, if "Jeremy Bentham" did have a teenage son, it certainly could be with Helen. The kid would (by your math) be 13 in 2007. Is Katey Segal going to make an appearance in Season 5?
I'd have a hard time believing that they didn't make the obit available for us to read for a reason. If they didn't want us to see what's on it, why not make it impossible to see? And if it's not significant, why put on there something about Bentham having a son? So Locke could indeed have a son, or perhaps it is the identity he assumed that has a son? Where was the son during the funeral? I'm still quite confused and perturbed by this. And the more I think of it, the more crazy ideas flow into my head and it's impossible to make sense of them all and write them out! Arrgh.
I definitely feel there are Dark Tower parallels, but I don't want to say too much while you're still in progress. But the island as nexus of time and space doesn't seem too unreasonable.
The panopticon is definitely significant, I think, but all the philosopher names have to mean something. The question is what? They don't necessarily give us an insight into the characters; John Locke is not necessarily like John Locke.
But Bentham was a Utilitarianist,and isn't that what Ben is (or at least, purports to be)? Isn't that what Locke might be, or at least become?
The clothes! Why are all these little things so mysterious? Is Cuselof determined to wire new neural pathways in my brain? Walt told Michael that the Others "pretended". (I don't remember the exact line.) All of us naturally thought of the fake beard at the time, as well as the barefoot jungle trek observed by Jin and Eko. As far as I know, they haven't started wearing fake beards again. Just the clothes. And barefoot again, you say? I admit I hadn't noticed that. Barefoot is definitely more natural, and probably more stealthy.
But back to the clothes and pretending. They weren't pretending in New Otherton, because they were having book clubs in Dharma houses before the crash. Is this part of what Ben was doing that was creating a rift, the supposed two factions of Others? Fertility projects and luxury living? Certainly he would have been the first Other leader to do that. But if that was a problem, why didn't Jacob tell him to stop? Why did he have to get cancer, then be suplanted?
I'm starting to get to tangential. It's hard to avoid.
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